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RE: Lag screws in withdrawal from end gr[Subject Prev][Subject Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next]
- To: <seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org>
- Subject: RE: Lag screws in withdrawal from end gr
- From: "Dennis S. Wish PE" <wish(--nospam--at)cwia.com>
- Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 15:51:40 -0700
I was a member of the (then) Hazardous Building Committee under Dave Brieholtz PE. One of our chores was to proof read the final draft of the City of Los Angeles RGA Provisions (Unreinforced Masonry Retrofit Code). Half of the difficulty in the final stages was to determine which word was appropriate and which would cause the least confusion. These included words of intent such as *will* and *shall*. I don't think any of us actually figured out what was appropriate since each had a connotation that created potential confusion. Our opinion was that if it does not say *Will*, *Shall* or *Must* then the subject is open to some interpretation and the engineers judgement comes into play. The words *Should* and *May* are such words that allows interpretation - *if the engineer can prove an acceptable alternative*. For this reason alone, I gave the members of code creation committees the greatest kudos for their efforts. If I recall, this was the last meeting I attended before leaving for the desert. I doubt that I would have continued on the committee through this phase of code developement since I found it most frustrating. As an engineer, I soon learned that virtually nothing is carved in stone. The code is a guidance for professionals that outlines an acceptable standard. As we have debated, it is also a minimum standard intended for non-professional to follow (Conventional Framing). It has been my experience that alternative methods are allowed if the engineer can justify his work. One example: I was providing the City of La Quinta plan check services for the famous La Quinta Hotel - an eighty year old (or older) adobe structure. The engineer who designed the retrofit did not work from the typical code - a working stress methodology. Instead, he used an ultimate strength method that I was not familiar. The engineers credentials and reputation with unreinforced masonry and Adobe was unquestionable. Although I needed time to compare the results, it turned out to be comparable, albeit slightly less restrictive, than convential code. The local building official was willing to accept the engineers work considering the historic value of the structure and the need to make the work invisible to the public. I suggested some minor changes regarding secondary suppports that included some decrative corbles and heavy timber in order to maintain the aesthetics of the building and the work was permited. The point is that we need to be creative and our creativity includes our engineering judgement. Engineers are not simply math crunching scientists - we are part of a very creative field. Therefore, we need to be willing to step out on a ledge at times in order to solve a problem. Codes are not meant to create one solution to a problem. They are simply guidlines to follow. Most structures lie somewhere in the grey area's. This is where creativity and judgment go hand in hand. Even a creative solutions can have conservative results. This is what our clients expect of us and probably annoys the hell of of most plan check engineers:>) regards Dennis Wish PE -----Original Message----- From: Bill Allen, S.E. [mailto:bill(--nospam--at)allendesigns.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 1998 2:10 PM To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org Subject: RE: Lag screws in withdrawal from end gr I guess building codes need to be more directive by using the phrases "shall" and "shall not" since we engineers are incapable of properly interpreting the intent of the phrase "should not". Regards, Bill Allen -----Original Message----- From: ErnieNSE(--nospam--at)aol.com [mailto:ErnieNSE(--nospam--at)aol.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 1998 11:58 AM To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org Subject: Re: Lag screws in withdrawal from end gr Roger, I still want to know why they used the word "should not". <snip>
- RE: Lag screws in withdrawal from end gr
- From: Bill Allen, S.E.
- RE: Lag screws in withdrawal from end gr
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