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Re: AISC II (the facts)

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All of this about AISC seems to me to be much ado about very little. I
can't imagine that the properties have changed very much. The detailing I
do is not dependent on minor changes. A couple of times I specified a
beam that was not available and the contractor's steel fabricator called
and we substituted one that weighed 1 lb./ft. less and that was all there
was to it.

Stan Scholl, P. E.

On Sun, 22 Apr 2001 12:19:16 -0700 "Structuralist" <dennis.wish(--nospam--at)>
> RE: AISC II (the facts)According to the information AISC provided me, 
> the
> answer is no, you can not recreate the data. The radius of flange to 
> web
> varies from mill to mill and, according to AISC, the information 
> from the
> mill is not available to anyone other than AISC and this may be the 
> issue.
> I think that it has not been tested legally and this leads to a 
> great deal
> of confusion. Personally, I would never have purchased my AISC 
> manual for
> the database alone. The values are too easy to obtain through the 
> software I
> use or from other sources. I purchased the AISC manual for the 
> technical
> information (as opposed to physical properties). The database has no 
> other
> real value to me other than a convenience or use to create my own
> proprietary tools.
> If AISC wanted to charge a reasonable price of say $10.00 to provide 
> a
> spreadsheet of Properties, I would not complain as I would feel I am 
> paying
> a reasonable price for that would save me the trouble of copying the
> information manually. In the end, it is a question of just how legal 
> is
> their copyright on this information? Seem like a big waste of time 
> to argue
> about it when AISC would gain more appreciation from the 
> professional
> community than they would resentment. Is the revenue that AISC makes 
> on the
> database worth the harmful public relations that this issue has 
> raised?
> One final note. I am not suggesting nor am I condoning the use of
> intimidation. Nor am I suggesting that AISC use intimidation in the 
> form of
> legal threats against those who have obtained the database and who 
> are using
> it to either create design software, distribution to public domain 
> or for
> proprietary use. This is what leads to resentment and accusations of
> "bashing".  It is an issue that deserves a legal interpretation by 
> an
> impartial third party. This will do much to help resolve the issue 
> to the
> satisfaction of the majority - the professional practioners who rely 
> on the
> information.
> Regards,
> Dennis S. Wish, PE
>   -----Original Message-----
>   From: John P. Riley [mailto:jpriley485(--nospam--at)]
>   Sent: Sunday, April 22, 2001 8:29 AM
>   To: seaint(--nospam--at)
>   Subject: Re: AISC II (the facts)
>   I'm sorry, I haven't followed this thread closely.  Can someone 
> answer a
> couple of simple questions for me?
>   1)  Would it be legal for me to type all the AISC info into my own
> spreadsheet?
>   2)  Would it be legal for me to give that spreadsheet to a 
> colleague?
>   __________________
>   John P. Riley, PE, SE
>   Riley Engineering
>   20 Oakwood Drive, Blue Grass, Iowa 52726
>   Tel & Fax:  319-381-3949
>   jpriley485(--nospam--at)

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