Need a book? Engineering books recommendations...

Return to index: [Subject] [Thread] [Date] [Author]

Re: Wood Fasteners [was Re: Re: 1/3 increase]

[Subject Prev][Subject Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next]
Once upon a time in another career:
   While analyzing and designing for retrofitting Div 88 URM buildings 
we would place on the plans and specs sheets to scale drawings and 
pictures of the "nails" and "screws" as called out on the plans. We 
were supervising our own crews at the time and found that through 
proper supervision, training and LA City enforcment we got the message 
   However, we exposed ourselves to problems on our first very large 
open roof and plywood shear wall project when using "craft carpenters" 
and "subcontract framers". Those experienced and very knowledgable 
persons used fasteners that stated "common" on the box but at the time 
the import from overseas was definitely other material. And, true to 
form, the subcontract framer would point to the box and claim 
ignorance. We pointed to the plans and suggested other arrangements. 
>From then on, we returned to using our own people with proper 
supervison, training and LA City enforcement.
   There was also a period where imported bolts stamped with the three 
lines on the head to indicate an ASTM A325 HS Bolts were made out of 
pot metal and A307 and other junk. Those three innocent marks commaded 
so muich more money.
  Always, buyer beware, always.
Pax e Gratia
Bob Ross
Robert P. Ross, P.E.
Principal Project Manager
Washington Group International,Inc.
Industrial Processes
17320 Red Hill, Suite 300
Irvine, Ca. 92614 
Mobile 562-254-4604
Office 949-222-3978
FAX 949-222-3985
E-mail: Bob.Ross(--nospam--at)

----- Original Message -----
From: "Nels Roselund, SE" <njineer(--nospam--at)>
Date: Wednesday, October 31, 2001 5:55 pm
Subject: Wood Fasteners [was Re: Re: 1/3 increase]

> George,
> I find nail sizes on the job are difficult to control.  A framer 
> was using
> nails that were specified to be 16d commons.  I could tell by the 
> head size
> of installed nails that they were not 16d commons -- they looked 
> like 8d
> commons.  I challenged the framer about it.  He showed me the box 
> they were
> in [a box of about 15# of nails] -- it was labeled 16d common.  I 
> don't know
> what they really are, but they are the diameter of an 8d common nail
> [0.131"], and 3-1/4" long instead of 3-1/2".  The actual diameter 
> and length
> were printed on the box under the label "16d Common".  The framer 
> "knew"that he was using what was specified -- not because of the 
> size notations,
> but because the box said "16d Common".
> I'm thinking of requiring that a board that displays a specimen of the
> actual nail of each specified size be submitted to the Engineer 
> prior to
> beginning construction -- after my review and acceptance, the 
> board would be
> set up on the site to be used to compare a nail with the 
> acceptable standard
> for each structural nail size.  Has anyone tried this?
> Fasteners for wood construction are a big problem -- in addition 
> to nails,
> wood screws and lag screws listed in the NDS seem to be impossible 
> to find
> on the supplier's shelf, and, if apparently found, impossible to 
> verify on
> the job.  I specify the Simpson SDS1/4 screws whenever practical --
> at least
> you know what you are specifying, the ICBO ES report makes clear 
> what the
> allowable values are for just about any application, and they can be
> identified after installation.  But at $0.75 + per screw they are 
> prettypricey.
> How are you guys and gals handling this wood fastener business?
> Nels Roselund
> Structural Engineer
> South San Gabriel, CA
> njineer(--nospam--at)

******* ****** ******* ******** ******* ******* ******* ***
*   Read list FAQ at:
*   This email was sent to you via Structural Engineers 
*   Association of Southern California (SEAOSC) server. To 
*   subscribe (no fee) or UnSubscribe, please go to:
*   Questions to seaint-ad(--nospam--at) Remember, any email you 
*   send to the list is public domain and may be re-posted 
*   without your permission. Make sure you visit our web 
*   site at: 
******* ****** ****** ****** ******* ****** ****** ********