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Re: Engineers versus detailers Part 1

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I would agree with most of what your other engineer posted.  We work
primarily on the west coast and steel connections are designed and detailed
on the drawings. We provide typical details that are modified to reflect the
project conditions for standard beam connections, and specific details for
all non-typical conditions.  We do not rely on a detailer to provide
connection design.  Shop drawing review is to ensure compliance with the
design we have provided, not as an opportunity to finish or alter a design.

I particularly agree with the statements that if the design work is not
done, you should send the job back.

As an additional issue, we state in our drawing notes that substitutions or
modifications to the provided design / connections shall be requested by the
fabricator and approved separately and prior to the shop drawing submittal.
Requests for substitution on the shop drawing submittal will not be
accepted.

Paul Feather PE, SE
pfeather(--nospam--at)SE-Solutions.net
www.SE-Solutions.net
----- Original Message -----
From: "G Vishwanath" <gvshwnth(--nospam--at)yahoo.com>
To: <seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org>
Sent: Wednesday, October 23, 2002 9:56 PM
Subject: Engineers versus detailers Part 1


> Seaint list memebers.
>
> I am an engineer now involved in steel detailing.
> In addition to this list I am also a member of a
> mailing list devoted to steel detailing.
>
> A member in the steel detailer's list
> raised an issue regarding the common practice of
> Engineers nowadays relying on "catch all" notes in
> their contract drawings that make fabrication
> needlessly costlier.
>
> In particular the connections for beams with short
> spans are needlessly expensive when the instruction to
> design the connection for half the uniform load
> capacity is taken literally.
>
> Often it has been pointed out that Engineers do not
> complete their work and use the shop drawing approval
> process to firm up their incomplete designs.
> Many pass the buck to the detailer when it comes to
> indicating special connection requirments.
>
> If web doublers or stiffeners are required, they do
> not check it and expect the detailer to do so. The
> detailer may not be technically competent to do so. If
> he is an engineer, he may not have all the design
> information necessary. Special details which should
> have been shown in the contract drawings are marked in
> the shop drawings during the approval process.
>
> In the course of this thread, one engineer member
> posted his views with which I agreed.
>
> I will be grateful if those of you with interest in
> design and detailing of steel structures can find the
> time (later if not now) to read this and post your
> views.
>
> I am prepared to send the complete transcripts of the
> thread to those who request it. I had sent it to this
> list and it did not get posted.
> I received a message that it was too long to be posted
> to this list.
>
> I am therefore avoiding posting the complete
> transcript and instead sending this mail and will
> follow it up with another containing only the text of
> the particular mail from an engineer member to which I
> have referred to above.
>
> I am very much interested in knowing the views of
> other engineers on this seaint list.
> I will compile them and post them back on the steel
> detailers list.
>
> Regards
> G Vishwanath
>
> ==============
>
>
> __________________________________________________
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