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I don’t agree with you on this one. First, the H-1b cap has been extinguished and no longer exists. It was to be doubled, but in the current year, the limit was not reached – yet the database does not negate the existence of Structural Engineers hired with H-1b contracts through 2004.


An H-1b worker can apply for permanent status once he arrives in the United States. Essentially, he does jump over the quotas and he does this by paying for legal representation. The trick is that he must obtain permanent residency (green-card) before his contract gives up and his employer may apply for extensions up to, I believe it has been increased, six years. This is generally within the time it takes to obtain approval of permanent status.


Outsourcing when work is available in the United States my serve companies who seek labor at lower rates but threaten workers wages in this country. Gail Kelley (GSKWY(--nospam--at) said it very eloquently as  has the foresight to see what would happen if our rates were lowered in this country to compete against others. Our debtors would not dismiss or lower our debt as Roosevelt devaluated the dollar in the mid 1940’s). We would either default or be working multiple jobs (and those being hands on positions that can’t be outsourced).


There are problems with the transfer of goods back and forth between companies that produce products in other nations. However, they must find their niche as opening a MacDonald’s or Burger King only perpetuates the global profits of that company for its shareholders. It does nothing for new start-ups that must compete but can’t handle the advertising budges. The same is true of Global Entertainment copyrights. Schwarzenegger is earning residuals in foreign markets wherever his films are shown. Ultimately these siphons off any available financial resources back to the resource holder and in some cases the government (in taxes).


David Fisher signs his posts with the name of a company in the Grand Cayman Island which are known tax shelters that can’t be touched by the United States. I don’t know his reason for this, but if David is avoiding paying taxes in the United States (and I am not suggesting he is) I would be against this as it depletes the cost of government and increases our deficit.


Unlike the man you met from India, there are no job gains in the United States when positions are outsourced. While his acquaintance may not be able to compete with McDonalds or Burger King, these companies offer jobs to those in India willing to work there. They don’t send Americans to do more than get the business off the ground and then they return to the states to let the businesses excel on their own.




-----Original Message-----
From: Shafat Qazi [mailto:seaint-ad(--nospam--at)]
Sent: Monday, November 10, 2003 6:42 PM
To: seaint(--nospam--at)



Well said! I have been reading this thread. Although it seems to change direction from "sending work overseas" to "Hiring foreign workers (H-1B)". These are two different issues and mixing them in one thread is confusing the issue.

Recently I was in India and met a business man on my plane ride. He owned a chain of Indian fast food restaurants and was complaining about Indian government allowing foreign business such as McDonald and Burger King to do business in India. This person ended up loosing most of his restaurants because he couldn't keep up with the competition. The point is, we are all complaining and trying to adjust to this new global economy.

Sending work to foreign countries should be left up to the business man not regulated by governments. That is what capitalism is all about. How many of us have purchased clothes, computers etc. based on where they were manufactured? The fact is we all look for the best deal in every aspect of our life. So lets stop complaining about companies sending work to foreign countries. Rather spend that time marketing our services and products to countries like Russia, China, India, Malaysia. There are a lot of people there you know, and we all could make a lot of money.

H1-B is altogether a different issue. Here are some facts that you must know:
1. There is a cap to the number of foreign workers that can come to US. The current cap is 65,000 per year.

2. A H1-B worker does not become a permanent resident automatically and does not jump ahead of others. There is a separate cap for green cards. Those caps are per country and issued based on date applied.

Thats is my take on it.


At 11/10/2003 04:47 PM, you wrote:


Thanks for the added perspective that was also going through my head, but
lacked the courage to articulate it.

I would add another perspective...

And how many foreign workers can get a job in their own country because
there are American's their in those jobs?  How many foreign companies lose
work in their own country to U.S. companies?

Protectionism is all fine and dandy, but if we fully "implement" it, then
what stops other countries from do the same?  What would happen to a lot
of the products that are sold outside of the US?  What would happen to
those American's who are employed about outside the US?

Like it or not, we are in a global economy.  There will be US workers who
lose jobs on our own soil due to foreign workers.  There will be US
workers who lose jobs due to companies shipping them overseas.  But,
hopefully there will be just as many Americans who get work overseas or
get jobs here when companies send jobs here.  Does this mean that
everything is on the "up and up" and that we can just sit back and have a
beer (or a caffience free Coke in my case)?  Nope.  There will be abuses
and corruption that will need to be watched for and dealt with.


Ypsilanti, MI

On Mon, 10 Nov 2003, Roger Turk wrote:

> I have started to respond to H1b threads on several occasions, but for one
> reason or another decided not to send the response.
> Do we forget that this is a nation of immigrants?  All of us, including the
> Native Americans, came from somewhere else.  Maybe our ancestors came because
> they were explorers; maybe they came because this was a land of opportunity,
> maybe they came because they were oppressed in their native country.
> I am a second generation American.  My grandparents came to this country in
> the late 1800's from Lithuania, Poland and Germany for the same reasons that
> people before and after have come here.  I welcome people who are courageous
> enough (or oppressed enough) to come to a country whose language is foreign
> and whose customs are strange to make a new life for themselves, their
> family, and particularly their children.
> No matter how skilled or learned our new immigrants may have been in their
> country of origin, they have to start anew here.  Many have had to take
> menial jobs until they learned the language, customs or procedures that were
> all too familiar to them in their native county.  They are willing to work
> for low wages because of the opportunities that await them.
> How can we forget that we, who have been born here, have spent more than 20
> years learning the English language, yet many of us still are not competent
> in expressing ourselves, cannot spell correctly, use incorrect words and
> cannot punctuate or capitalize correctly.  Why do we fault people who have
> only been here a few years for making what may be literal translations into
> English?
> I, for one, welcome these newcomers to the USA, the land of opportunity, and
> wish them the greatest success as many of those who have preceded them have
> achieved.
> A. Roger Turk, P.E.(Structural)
> Tucson, Arizona
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