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# RE: 2001 NDS nail penetration

• To: <seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org>
• Subject: RE: 2001 NDS nail penetration
• From: "Bill Allen" <T.W.Allen(--nospam--at)cox.net>
• Date: Mon, 7 Jun 2004 17:18:48 -0700

```Sooo...is what you are saying is that, by using the 2001 NDS, if you nail
two 2Xs together with a 10d nail (0.148 in dia) x 3" long, you'll have a
capacity of 118 lbs?

If so (and I *think* that's what you're saying), then the capacity in the
2001 NDS with 10D penetration is the same as the capacity in the 1997 NDS
with 12D penetration.

Sooo...I've been (tediously) reducing my 10d capacities needlessly because
the 1997 NDS is conservative in requiring 12D penetration. Crap! What a
waste of time!

T. William (Bill) Allen, S.E. (CA #2607)
ALLEN DESIGNS (http://www.AllenDesigns.com)
San Juan Capistrano, CA

:-----Original Message-----
:From: Bruce Pooley [mailto:bdpooley(--nospam--at)comcast.net]
:Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 5:03 PM
:To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org
:Subject: Re: 2001 NDS nail penetration
:
:Bill,
:
:The NDS 2001, Table 11N shows 118 for a 10d for DF-L. It assumes that the
:nail penetrates more than 10d since the side member is only 1 inch thick.
:
:When the side member is 1-3/4 inch thick, the table value is 118, however
:footnote 4 applies to the 10d nail and the value is adjusted by footnote 3
:that states that the table value is multiplied by p/10d.
:
:This is based on nailing through the side member into the main member.
:Footnote 2 requires that the nail penetration in the main member equal 10d.
:
:Bruce Pooley
:----- Original Message -----
:From: "Bill Allen" <T.W.Allen(--nospam--at)cox.net>
:To: <seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org>
:Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 4:49 PM
:Subject: RE: 2001 NDS nail penetration
:
:
:Nels -
:
:How 'bout the easy way:
:
:I've got the 1997 NDS and, as I said, table 12.3 shows a maximum capacity
:of
:118 lbs. This is for a 1" side member.
:
:What is the listed (tabulated) capacity of a 10d using DF-L in the 2001
:NDS?
:
:I'm just trying to compare "apples and apples". We can delve into the Yield
:Limit Equations at a later date (when we both have more time).
:
:T. William (Bill) Allen, S.E. (CA #2607)
:ALLEN DESIGNS (http://www.AllenDesigns.com)
:San Juan Capistrano, CA
:
::-----Original Message-----
::From: Nels Roselund, SE [mailto:njineer(--nospam--at)att.net]
::Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 3:41 PM
::To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org
::Subject: Re: 2001 NDS nail penetration
::
::Bill,
::
:the
::NDS are reduced.  I started out to make the calculations my self based on
::the Yield Limit Equations of the NDS.  First I found that I can't find my
::'97 NDS -- I'm using the 2001 edition now.  Then I found that the values I
::calculated do not match the NDS.  That may mean that the values are
::reduced,
::but it may also mean that I've made an error in my work.  First I need to
::make sure that I've made the calcualtions correctly, so I have to trouble
::shoot my mathcad calc.  I've run out of time to fiddle with this right
:now.
::
::I'm back to my old complaint that the NDS equations are not intuitive --
::there is no way that I can see to be able to look for errors in the
::formulas
::I've entered by asking, "does this make sense?"  The Yield Mode Equations
::aren't based on common sense as far as I can tell -- I guess they are
::empirical.
::
::Buddy Showalter -- do you have the answer?
::
::Nels
::
::Nels Roselund
::Structural Engineer
::South San Gabriel, CA
::njineer(--nospam--at)att.net
::
::
::
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