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RE: UBC Live Load Reduction - Epilogue

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However, I can certainly understand your position.



I find myself saying to my staff “let’s just do it and get the permit…” a LOT more than I used to

In the “old days,” like when I was under 40…


Let’s let these little demagogues have their day in the sun…it’s what they want.



I did it myself again yesterday on a project…


“Dave, I don’t care if the thing is X or Y, just get me the *(&^%$$(--nospam--at)# permit!”


If the owner doesn’t seem to care, why should I?






David L. Fisher SE PE

Senior Principal



372 West Ontario

Chicago 60610



312.573.1726 fax


312.622.0409 mobile


From: Bill Allen, S.E. [mailto:T.W.Allen(--nospam--at)]
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2005 8:10 AM
To: seaint(--nospam--at)
Subject: RE: UBC Live Load Reduction - Epilogue


Well, I’ve lost the battle. I have gone back and designed the footings for a roof live load of 20 PSF even though there is more than 600 SF tributary to the column and footing. Seems ridiculous, but I need to get this job off my desk. Back when I was younger (and needed to be right more often), I would have spent a lot more time arguing this point.


It’s amazing that both the outside plan checker and the building official look at this differently than I and apparently, different from those who responded to this comment on this list. The building official wasn’t just backing up the plan checker; it’s the way he’s always done it. His workaround is that he considers a footing an “element” and not a structural member such as a beam or column. Talk about semantics. Sheesh!


Scott – I even tried pulling out the IBC language (1607.9.2) in my defense, but the building officials’ response was “My boss has told me to ignore the IBC until it becomes the legal code”. Even so, there’s a problem with the lBC in that the definition doesn’t carry over to roof live loads. Hmmm…. Maybe it’s time to work on that since the 2006 IBC is in it’s last round of comments.


T. William (Bill) Allen, S.E. (CA #2607)


Consulting Structural Engineers

V (949) 248-8588

F (949) 209-2509