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RE: E-Files and Clients....

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I'm not sure what you are trying to infer, but let me say that there are
good and bad engineers everywhere. I also believe you get what you pay
for. I further believe that the most expensive fee is not necessarily
going to get you the best design and sometimes you are paying for the
name/reputation on the title block.

That said, your sacramento engineer's fee for a new house, regardless of
the size, is ridiculous. I do 500 square foot additions to wood frame
houses for more than that.

ICF homes are easy for me because I have a lot of experience in tilt-up
construction. Many facets are the same... the issues of wall anchorage
being the most critical. The issue with ICF homes that can be
challenging is when you have overhangs and setbacks (i.e. heavy walls
not stacked on the walls below them). There are many advantages to ICF
construction to the homeowner, the most obvious being energy efficiency
(sound and temperature). And I see no reason why an experienced
contractor couldn't out build a stick framer. Believe me, the stick
framed home is not being built by someone with a carpentry background.
Multi-million dollar homes are built with the cheapest labor available
and have the unskilled performing work with nail guns and saws. There is
usually 1 guy (the framing subcontractor foreman) who actually has a
global knowledge of the project-he is typically running 4-5 projects
simultaneously and often cannot keep close enough tabs on his crew.

Kevin, with all due respect, what you are doing could be construed as
shopping. Your email to Paul seems to shoot that theory a little. If you
are indeed willing to pay a suitable fee for a design, that's great. If
you are re-using the same plan over and over, you should not have to pay
full price again for the stamp. You should be willing to pay for
re-engineering of the lateral system and foundations on a site specific
basis and I'm glad you indicated that is reasonable to you. I think I
realize now from your further postings that you understand this and the
liability issues we engineers carry and therefore are well within our
rights to charge a re-use fee simply due to liability. Also, if you are
not using architects, the engineer becomes the sole target during
litigation, so our exposure is increased.

Again, if you hired someone like me, I would gladly give you the framing
plans and foundation plans in cad if you had a valid reason and would
continue to do so if you were using them in the spirit for which it was
intended (to aid others on the specific project). However, I would be
greatly disappointed, if I gave you my details, you go to your
sacramento engineer, and my work becomes his product.

Sounds like you are a good businessman. But I think a few thousand bucks
well spent on a well engineered set of plans is worth it for houses in
California with many risks (earthquake, fire etc...). I sincerely wish
you well.

Respectfully,
-gm  (your elder at 32 years of age)

p.s.: Glad you liked the music. In my opinion, my website sucks big
time, but it was the best I could do 3 years ago with Dream weaver and
no experience at building websites. When I finally get around to
updating it, I will hire someone who know what the hell they are doing.


-----Original Message-----
From: Kevin Polin [mailto:KevinPolin(--nospam--at)Cyberonic.com]
Sent: Monday, May 30, 2005 1:26 PM
To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org
Subject: RE: E-Files and Clients....

Thanks Gm,

Its funny an engineer from northern California told me:

> "To: anony-43106098(--nospam--at)craigslist.org
> Subject: Civil Engineer Needed
> All the good civils and structurals are in Nor Cal. We can assist you

> remote & stamp.
> Please forward the project data.
> Thanks, Terry

I don't want to start a war here but I am seeing a pattern. I guess he
knew what he was talking about or maybe I'm delusional.

Kevin



-----Original Message-----
From: Gerard Madden, SE [mailto:gmadden(--nospam--at)maddengine.com]
Sent: Monday, May 30, 2005 12:45 PM
To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org
Subject: RE: E-Files and Clients....

ICF homes are a piece of cake. Call me if you want some engineering
done. I'm in Northern, CA. You will be quoted a fair rate and you won't
get my details in cad...especially since it appears you are shopping for
the cheapest engineer you can get.

Best of luck in your business.
-gm

-----Original Message-----
From: Kevin Polin [mailto:KevinPolin(--nospam--at)Cyberonic.com]
Sent: Monday, May 30, 2005 7:56 AM
To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org
Subject: RE: E-Files and Clients....

Hi David,

Hmmm, that's a very funny question, but that depends on who you ask. If
you ask my girl friend and business partner, she says I don't do
anything. She says I'm a lazy bum and all I do is read news all day.

Now if you ask me that same question, I would have to say that I am a
visionary and thinker.

6 yrs ago I was a software developer in Irvine California but I have a
degree in Advertising Design (Long Story). Believe it or not while
playing an online video game late one night, a guy told me to buy real
estate. He said he was taking all of his money out of the market and
putting it in Real Estate, this was right before "9-11". So I bought a
bunch of real estate. Interest rates dropped property values
skyrocketed, Boom! I'm sitting on a few gold mines, multi-millionaire
overnight. But to me it's nothing because it can be gone tomorrow or I
could die and then it's worthless.

You can only buy so much property before the banks stop loaning you
money. So I am now taking the Equity out of my properties and putting
them into land development projects. So at this point I call myself a
developer. I have 3 projects waiting for engineering, and one I just
finished engineering I am in Los Angeles and I had to go all the way up
to Sacramento to get the project engineered affordably (I am sending him
detailed Video observations of the structural so he can sign off).

I am building fire resistive houses because I think it is the wave of
the future. In particular I am using "Insulated Concrete Forms". The
homeowners and the market is ready for this type of technology several
engineers that I know market themselves as "ICF Engineers", but I cannot
use them because they are to far away. (I cannot go into my whole
business plan here but this is the "Foundations" of my concept, which I
have ran by several people and they were surprised).

The problem that I am having is that engineers are very slow to adopt
new technology and many are scared away when you mention new technology
and never return calls, or raise the price so high that the adoption and
growth of new technologies is severely stunted. Besides they have plenty
of business with the old stuff, so why risk fooling with new stuff.

Please understand we do not need legislators telling us that the world
is changing "watch the news", the world is falling apart. We need to
build stronger more "environment proof housing" without the government
telling us we need to do something. We as engineers and citizens of the
United States should have already started. Architects hate me because I
always tell them that engineers are more important that Architects, but,
with engineers hoarding the good stuff like squirrels. New technology
will never take hold. This Neanderthal mentality must cease.

That's pretty much the main reason that I am PRO-DWG. I want to take a
standard plan and utilize it for multiple projects and have the engineer
re-adapt to the new project and stamp it quickly. SO WHAT IF SOMEBODY
LOOKS AT IT AND LEARNS SOMETHING, THEN THEY LEARN SOMETHING.

I don't use architects, so I have to use engineers but engineers need to
step up to the plate, and seed the new stuff out into the market so we
can go forward.

If I am wrong then slap me...

I am in a hurry so please excuse the grammar. I am a Visionary not an
English teacher.

P.S. I am 31yrs old.

Kevin
(A Visionary... one step ahead of his time)



-----Original Message-----
From: M. David Finley, P.E. [mailto:pec(--nospam--at)isgroup.net]
Sent: Monday, May 30, 2005 5:49 AM
To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org
Subject: Re: E-Files and Clients....

Kevin,

What exactly is your business?  Engineering?  Archtiecture?
Construction?

Just curious,

David Finley


----- Original Message -----
From: "Kevin Polin" <KevinPolin(--nospam--at)Cyberonic.com>
To: <seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org>
Sent: Friday, May 27, 2005 5:37 PM
Subject: RE: E-Files and Clients....



The CAD files are no good without a stamp and Signature.

I am not going to raise my costs and pay redraw fees just because an
engineer thinks he owns something "I paid him "ALOT OF MONEY" to draw
for ME".

David Fisher said: "that's how we MAKE money..."

So it's a MONEY THING? Just Like I thought, don't start talking like a
Neo-Con it's about more than just money it's about HAPPY CLIENTS and a
faster adaptation of new safer technology.

Kevin



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