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RE: concrete on standing water

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Acie,

No on second thought I would agree with you. I would let him place concrete with the odd 1" puddle if the subgrade was good. On small residential type structures, I have taken a #4 rebar and jabbed it into the soil to see if it has good refusal at no more than about 3". If there is no muck on top and the bar gets little penetration, I let him place the concrete. An old dirt dobber friend of mine taught me that one.

Mind you it is not a #3 or a #5. It has to be a #4 to be an official old dirt dobber penetrometer.

Regards,
Harold Sprague





From: "Chance, Acie" <AChance(--nospam--at)lacsd.org>
Reply-To: <seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org>
To: <seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org>
Subject: RE: concrete on standing water
Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 15:42:48 -0700

You guys are forcing me to do something I don't want to do, stick up for a contractor. If the whole bottom of the excavation is underwater then draining maybe required. If on the other hand there are only "puddles" which cover 25 to 30 percent of the surface area I do not think this is going to jeopardize the footings. You need to look at how critical the foundation is also. Most strip footings I have designed were based on soil pressure not concrete strength. All this to say a little additional water which is not mixed with the concrete should not be a major problem.

   OK now all you engineers who work in perfect worlds can take you shots.

Acie

-----Original Message-----
From: Harold Sprague [mailto:spraguehope(--nospam--at)hotmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 3:24 PM
To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org
Subject: RE: concrete on standing water


Concrete can be placed underwater as well.  But I doubt that a residential
mud slinger has the experience or the ability.

It is not a big deal to trench to a pit and pump it out.  I would want to
look at the soil to see if it being saturated would make a difference.  If
the saturation level of the soil is not a problem have him just get a cheap
sump pump and pump the water out.  It is not that big a deal.

Or you can have him get one of those mult-thousand dollar multi-thousand
horse power Wood 10,000 cfs pumps with a 12' diameter discharge that they
have in New Orleans.  No THAT is a pump.  I feel like Tim Allen!

Regards,
Harold Sprague





>From: "Eli Grassley" <elig(--nospam--at)psm-engineers.com>
>Reply-To: <seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org>
>To: <seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org>
>Subject: concrete on standing water
>Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 14:14:45 -0700
>
>Can anyone comment on the appropriateness of placing concrete on
>saturated soil?  I have a contractor that is asking if he can pour his
>strip footings thru some 1" standing puddles.  Said he has done it
>plenty of times in the past...
>
>TIA
>
>
>
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>Eli S. Grassley, PE
>
>PETERSON, STREHLE, MARTINSON, INC.
>
>
>

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