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RE: California contract law

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Calling the Board is a good idea.  I will offer, however, that they MAY
say that you must submit an official request for an interpretation to the
attorney general's (for the state)...this was the case when I had a
question about the PE Act in Michigan...basically the idea is that the AG
is that "interpretor" for the State (unless the matter goes to court, in
which case the court becomes the "interpretor").

As to Paul's response, I took his response to mean that a non-engineer
owner/rep of the company could sign the contract but you would still need
to potentially have listed a responsible engineer (including their
license number).  I don't know if that is a correct interpretation of the
CA law or not (I might have a better opinion after I sit down to read the
law provisions...I have to do so in order to complete the take-home
law/ethics exam as part of getting my CA PE license) or if I am
interpreting Paul's interpretation of the CA law correctly.

Just my 2 cents.

Scott
Adrian, MI


On Tue, 1 Nov 2005, Yi Yang wrote:

> This is confusing then, so what you are saying is that the person who signs the contract does not need to be a registered engineer, therefore no need to list PE number on the contract?
>
> I guess I should call the board.
>
>
> Y i   Y a n g,   S. E.
> STRUCTURAL DIVISION
> SUMMIT ENGINEERING INC.
> 707.527.0775.x162
> Santa Rosa, California
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: Paul Feather [mailto:pfeather(--nospam--at)SE-Solutions.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 1:57 PM
> To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org
> Subject: Re: California contract law
>
>
> What you list is true, however there are other provisions in the code.
>
> Under the current regulations, a non-engineer may be an owner or part owner provided there IS at least one registered engineer in charge of engineering work.  The engineer legally must stamp and sign engineering work; however a contract agreement is not engineering work.  A financial officer or other legal representative of a firm may create legally binding contracts without being an engineer. As long as a duly registered engineer is listed as responsible for the work, it does not matter which corporate entity actually signs the contract.
>
> Oddly enough, there are direct provisions where a non-engineer owner cannot legally include their name as part of the firm name; but this does not prohibit the non-engineer owner from entering into legally binding agreements as the firm representative.
>
> Paul Feather PE, SE
> www.SE-Solutions.net
> pfeather(--nospam--at)SE-Solutions.net
>
> 	----- Original Message -----
> 	From: S. Gordin <mailto:mailbox(--nospam--at)sgeconsulting.com>
> 	To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org
> 	Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 12:52 PM
> 	Subject: Re: California contract law
>
> 	Joe,
>
> 	This is not about a proposal, but about a contract; IMO, these two are quite different.
>
> 	The law is specific: "Before the Professional Engineer or Professional Land Surveyor begins work, they [PE-SG] need to sign a written contract with their client, or his or her representative. ..The written contract must include, but not be limited to, all of the . following:... 3. The name, address, and license or certificate number of the Professional Engineer..."
>
> 	From the horse's mouth (California Business and Professions Code) this sounds like "6749. (a) A professional engineer shall use a written contract when contracting to provide professional engineering services to a client pursuant to this chapter. The written contract shall be executed by the professional engineer and the client, or his or her [client's, not PE's-SG] representative..."
>
> 	Of course, this is all legal mumbo-jumbo, and we all long for a "word and handshake" contracts - but that's what it is.  And in situations that it may be questionable, it is always prudent to follow the letter of the law (refer to BORPELS bulletins).
>
> 	And I've been wrong before, so whatever was offered above is just 2 cents (not necessarily mine), with no other value declared, expressed, or implied. :^)
>
> 	Steve Gordin SE
> 	Irvine CA
>
>
>
> 		----- Original Message -----
> 		From: Jnapd(--nospam--at)aol.com
> 		To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org
> 		Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 12:22 PM
> 		Subject: Re: California contract law
>
>
> 		Steve:
>
> 		I disagree on this one.
>
> 		The proposal is to inform the client which registered engineer is will be signing the plans and calculations.  I do not see anything in the law that indicates that the registered engineer has to produce or sign the proposal.
>
> 		Joe Venuti
> 		Johnson & Nielsen Associates
> 		Palm Springs, CA
>
>
>

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