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Re: retail center lateral system (3 sided masonry)

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Thanks everyone for the replies and input.  As
expected, there is support for both lateral resisting

I guess that I'm just a bit conservative in my
thinking.  It's been my belief that in order to
analyze the deck to transfer the torsional loads to
the NS walls (short walls), the deck would have to be
considered rigid.  I've always considered 1.5" wide
rib roof deck (without concrete topping) to be
considered flexible.  I'm investigating the "Diaphragm
flexibility limitation" tables found in the ICBO
reports to justify the deck stiffness, but I've never
looked at these tables before.

I haven't run the analysis, but maybe cantilevering
the deck from the back wall wouldn't be a big deal
since the building is 300'x90'.  Like any cantilever
system, I get worried about deflection.  Especially,
since the cantilevered end side has glass.

I also thought about an expansion joint when first saw
the length of the building.  But, this lateral
discussion put that on the back burner.  I believe,
without running the numbers, that the temp differences
don't neccesitate an expansion joint for the deck.

Thanks again!

--- Will Haynes <gtg740p(--nospam--at)> wrote:

> I would be concerned if you were cantilevering the
> 300ft dimension instead of the 90 ft.  I wouldn't
> think cantilevering 90ft with a 300ft depth would be
> a big deal. Is there going to be an expansion joint?
> Will
> > 		----- Original Message ----- > 		From: Brian
> <mailto:bsh117(--nospam--at)>  > 		To: seaint(--nospam--at)
> > 		Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 9:21 AM> 		Subject:
> retail center lateral system (3 sided> masonry)> > 	
> I need some help to settle an office dispute.> 		> 	
> Currently we have a 1-story retail center project>
> in> 		our office.  The building is rectangular and>
> approx> 		300 ft running in the NS direction and 90
> ft in> the EW> 		direction.  The entire East face of
> the building> is> 		storefront glass (300 ft) and
> wraps about 20 ft on> the> 		North and South faces. 
> The rest of the building,> 		which consists of the
> entire West face and the> 		remaining portions of
> the North and South face, is> 		contructed out of 8"
> masonry.  The roof is> constructed> 		of joists,
> joist girders and metal deck and there> are> 	
> interior steel columns and steel columns at the> 	
> storefront to support.> 		> 		Our differences come
> about for the lateral system> in> 		the long
> direction of the building.  My co-worker> 		would
> like to design this building without a> lateral> 	
> frame on the East face and rely entirely on the> 	
> masonry shear wall on the West face.  However, I> 	
> believe that a lateral frame is required because I>
> do> 		not believe the metal roof deck can transfer
> the> 		entire lateral force in that direction to the
> West> 		face of the building.> 		> 		We are mainly
> dealing with lateral forces due to a> 		basic wind
> speed of 90 mph.> 		> 		I would appreciate any other
> opinions out there.> 		> 		Thanks!> 		Brian>  	
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