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Re: Re: real life seismic house test

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That was sort of my point.  There are pressures, (mostly economic) which drive the sloppiness that abounds in smaller projects and they include everything from sloppy, inexperienced workers to sloppy inexperienced engineers and architects.

What is truly at issue here is the brain-drain that permeates all phases of the industry and its not getting better, its getting worse.  I spent a couple thousand dollars advertising for architectural help and finally gave up after 3 or 4 months of, not bad applicants, NO applicants.  I never even got to the salary part.  The one and only promising guy I met spoke broken english and lived 50 miles away...  

Let's face it.  Design and Construction simply is apparently not a sexy career path for a kid making life choices in high school. 

 --Don

  Absolutely. In recognition of the condition of CA for residentialprojects, I recommend that there be no contact between anyone on thedesign team and anyone in the field. I would go so far as to suggestthat the documents include marketing floor plans drawn in pencil on an8.5x11 sheet of paper at 1/19" scale, along with a front elevation(only).  A "clean room" implementation of the design, so to speak. 

Actually, you could interpret half of the bullets in Andrew's list asfalling on the shoulders of the drawing board folks -  the first threeare, the fourth has nothing to do with the contractor, and the fifth iswhat you get when the Engineer never answers the phone or returnscalls.  The three beer lunch, inexperienced workers and disregard forprepared plans, well, those three definitely fall on the contractor'sside. 
Jordan

Donald Bruckman wrote:                
Not to rainon the parade of field constructionbashing, but could we also have the thing built off plans with missingpad footings,missing dimensions, no continuity of OTM load path and a structuralengineerthat doesn?t return phone calls?   
   
We?re allhuman, trying to getalong, but this constant whining between the field and the drawingboard thatseems to permeate the industry gets a bit tiresome for me.  
   
--Don  
         
From: Andrew Kester, PE[mailto:akester(--nospam--at)cfl.rr.com] 
  Sent: Wednesday,November 15, 20066:40 AM
  To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org
  Subject: real lifeseismic housetest    
     
So here is the pessimistin me coming out, so forgive mebeforehand. But anytime you try and replicate a real life scenario in alab,the results can be just slightly off the real thing. Britainmade the first commercialjetliner and did all of their pressure tests in a lab. After 2 crasheskillingall the passengers on board, because of stress failures at squarewindows dueto real life compression/decompression, the company eventually quitmakingplanes..      
       
When you are dealing withsomething like RESIDENTIALCONSTRUCTION, there is so much variance in the quality of the designandconstruction, I cannot see what this will really tell us. I understandCA ispretty strict with plan review, who designs houses, and inspections,but fromwhat I gather the rest of the country is not the same.      
       
So, my real life testwould be:      
-Have a "designer" drawup the plans, and guess atthe connections. Maybe let an architect with limited structuralknowledge signand seal it, or an engineer who doesn't care how he makes $500 blindlyseal it.      
-Let a GC build it on thefly using prescriptive codes      
-Do not have an engineerdo any site observations, becausehis CA fee is WAY too high      
-Have the inspector stayin his truck for the inspection,not bring his ladder because of liability, or spend a half hour takinga quickglance. Or allow the scientists at the lab to "good ole boy" theirway out of the inspection.      
-Allow the builders tosubstitute connections, changedetails, or make modifications at will      
-Allow drinking duringconstruction      
-Have the majority of thework done by unexperienced,unsupervised workers who just got here from a poor country withoutsimilarconstruction. They cannot speak english or read the plans. (Don't readintothis comment, it is not about immigration, about unskilled workers.)      
-If there are plans onsite, they are over in the corner alldirty and tattered..      
       
Now throw it on the tableand let it shake....      
       
Andrew Kester, PE
ADK Structural Engineering, PLLC
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