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Re: ICC Green Building Code

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Architects use the building code too...who says we engineers need to take the lead on these issues? They ask me for recycled content of steel, how much slag in the concrete mix, and I'm done. I don't need LEED certification for that although it would be nice to have that.

Now, they want to make the building twice as heavy with radiant floors and green roofs, that's there call.

Many jurisdictions in California have adopted LEED mandates. A lot of public projects must at least reach a LEED Silver designation.

The main cost in this appears to be the jump from LEED Gold to LEED Platinum.

Anyway, green issues and design, while often a pain in the structural engineers' ass, doesn't appear to be killing projects...wall street, banks, and politicians seem to be the slayers of great projects.

I just finished a LEED Platinum building with Geothermal borings, green roofs, radiant floors etc.... and working on another with Passive Ventilation. I can tell you that Architects are WAY WAY WAY into this stuff, it's not going away whether it's in the building code or not.

Of course, if you believe the globe isn't warming, the earth was created in 144 60-minute hours and is 5000 years old and humans and dinosaurs walked the earth together like the Flintstones - all of this LEED GREEN stuff is hogwash.

-gm



On Tue, Jul 14, 2009 at 11:23 AM, Timothy Hilton <thilton(--nospam--at)lhcengineers.com> wrote:
To be fair, Stan didn't argue in favor of trashing the planet or seceding
from the United States.

Insults aside, what about the construction concerns in his email?  Namely,
should this be a code issue?  Shouldn't engineers be leading these kinds of
discussions, without getting caught in emotions and insults?

Timothy K. Hilton, E.I.
Engineering Intern

LHC STRUCTURAL ENGINEERS
P.O. Box 10567
1015 Wade Avenue
Raleigh, NC 27605-0567

919.832.5587 x 20
thilton(--nospam--at)lhcengineers.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Chuck Utzman [mailto:chuckutzman(--nospam--at)gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 1:53 PM
To: seaint(--nospam--at)seaint.org
Subject: Re: ICC Green Building Code

Stan
Maybe Rick Perry has it right. You, Bill P., et al should secede
(again).  Here in CA, several private groups have stepped in and created
their own "green" standards & they are being adopted by local
jurisdictions.  I have some serious reservations about how well they are
researched/written. Perhaps IBC can do a better/more rational job &
provide a consistent set of standards--I guess we'll see.  Meanwhile
you, Bill, & Jim Inhofe can argue for your "god given" right to trash
the planet, but last year we had an election & you lost--get over it.
Chuck Utzman, P.E.

Stan Caldwell wrote:
> Call me old-fashioned.  I have always understood that the sole purpose
> of any model building code is to provide a regulatory framework for
> public safety.  In fact, the website for the folks behind the IBC
> family of codes is www.iccsafe.org <http://www.iccsafe.org/>.  As
> discussed on this Listserv a few years ago, building codes have never
> addressed aesthetics, economics, serviceability, and so forth.  Public
> safety has always been their sole focus.
>
> Now, that all appears to be changing.  On June 29, ICC announced that
> it is teaming with AIA and ASTM to develop the "International Green
> Construction Code" (IGCC) focused on new and existing commercial
> buildings.  In a press release on that date,  Code Council Chief
> Executive Officer Richard P. Weiland stated "We believe the time has
> come for us to develop a code that will stand as a useful and credible
> regulatory framework for creating a greener commercial building
> stock."  Really, I am not making this stuff up:
>
> http://www.iccsafe.org/news/nr/2009/0629_IGCC.pdf
>
> Now, I have no problem with promoting sustainable principles as long
> as they are based on innovation, best-practices, and proven science.
>  My wife and I have recycled everything imaginable for the better part
> of three decades.  We recently replaced all three of our big
> residential HVAC systems with new equipment that is so efficient that
> President Obama is funding part of our expenditures with your tax
> dollars.  [Note:  This is a federal gift, it did not influence our
> purchase decision.]  With an incentive from the State of Texas, I also
> recently replaced a few dozen perfectly good incandescent light bulbs
> with dimmer, goofy-looking compact florescent bulbs.  Some of the
> engineers on my staff are actively pursuing LEED accreditation.  I
> applaud that, as we will better be able to serve our clients who
> voluntarily seek to have their projects LEED-certified.  The key word,
> of course, is VOLUNTARILY.
>
> I have two problems with ICC pursuing the IGCC.  First, if they are
> truly compelled to venture beyond safety, I would much prefer that
> they focus on serviceability.  Issues like floor vibration, for
> example, remain fuzzy areas of structural engineering practice that
> attract unnecessary liability.  Second, as one who believes that
> climate science is mostly nonsense, I oppose any effort that will lead
> to sustainability regulations being embedded into the building codes.
>  To the extent that sustainability principles have merit, public
> pressure and economic considerations will promote their implementation
> much more effectively than regulation ever could.  Yes, I still
> believe in old-fashioned capitalism.
>
> Regards,
>
> Stan R. Caldwell, P.E., SECB
> Proud to be in Texas
> The Carbon Capital of North America


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